Denying AIDS: Conspiracy Theories, Pseudoscience, and Human Tragedy

Seeking Stories of AIDS Denialism

Have you or someone you know been harmed by AIDS Denialism? If you, or someone you care about, have been advised to stop taking HIV meds, ignore HIV test results, purchase a 'natural' cure etc., please email me.

All information will be kept confidential.

Tuesday, September 28, 2010

How AIDS Denialism Can Kill You Part V: Is it too late for Karri Stokely?

For years, Christine Maggiore was the face of AIDS Denialism. When she died of AIDS in 2008, many people thought it would bring an end to the craziness. It did not.  

Just as Christine Maggiore  denied that her baby died of AIDS, her followers claimed that Christine died from the stress caused by a Law and Order SVU episode that portrayed her life.

Soon after Christine Maggiore died, there was a new face of AIDS Denialism. Karri Stokely, an HIV positive mother of two who has repeatedly shared her story of how HIV medications, not HIV, nearly killed her. Karri Stokely became seriously ill while taking anti-HIV medications and believes that her health only improved because she stopped the medications. She has appeared healthy ever since.  That is until now.

Karri Stokely has shared that she developed a serious ulceration in her colon. Untreated, the ulcer will perforate her colon and could kill her. Her doctors cannot perform life saving surgery because her immune system is too compromised and she refuses HIV treatments. She believes HIV treatments are toxic and that they caused her ulcerated colon in the first place.

Karri Stokely's condition is serious. She says she is in terrible pain.  No one in their right mind can feel good about this. I am sure that the AIDS Deniers will say that I am celebrating her falling ill. They are sick enough to believe that. 

My honest hope is that she will stop listening to the insanity and start listening to her doctors. Even if just until they save her life. It sounds like it is not too late. Her condition is treatable and her immune system may be salvageable. There is no question that a lot of people care for this woman.  Anyone who truly cares about her will tell her to do whatever is necessary to medically treat her condition, before it is too late. 


 By Karri Stokely

Have you ever found yourself taking a long, horrific, and unexpected journey through the bowels of hell?
Has it ever even occurred to you that you may end up being forced into taking this little trip through the world of modern medicine?
Would you ever, in your wildest dreams, think that you would have to play a game, literally, with bargaining chips, to get a surgery that was rapidly becoming crucial to saving your life?

This is what I've been dealing with the past 2 weeks. The story is so long and horrifying, it would bring tears to the eyes of the strongest if I had the time to share every little detail.

I'm going to condense this into a nutshell, because so many people have asked and expressed the help and concern.
I tested "positive" on a non-specific antibody test called the "HIV" test back in 1996. (You may read my story in full, or listen to radio podcasts for the entire background here:
Although I was not in a considered "risk group", I believed in doctors, medicine, and tests.
I believed what they told me.  I willingly submitted to taking very toxic anti-retroviral drugs for 11 years, believing the entire time that I was infected with a deadly, killer virus.
Every single day, from June 1996-April 2007, I swallowed AZT, 3TC, Crixivan and then Sustiva.

After immense research into the genocidal world of HIV/AIDS, I quit all of these drugs in April 2007.
Since then, I have been on a journey trying to rebuild and repair the damage done by the black-box, nucleoside analogue, cell killing poisons.  

Overall, I have felt fairly well the past 3 1/2 years since quitting these drugs.

I lead a very active life. I jog. I am raising two teenagers. I'm involved in a number of different things that keep me busy. My husband and I will have our 20th wedding anniversary on Oct. 6th.

I am the AIDS establishment's worst nightmare. 

The biggest problem that I've been struggling with since quitting these drugs is a large amount of damage to the gastrointestinal tract. I do not digest food well. I don't have much stomach acid. There is no peristalsis left in the colon. The colon appears almost "dead". And when I do move my bowels, it's all diarrhea. In the past 2 years, I've been dealing with an anal fissure, produced by struggling and immobility.

All of this is a direct result of drug damage from the "life-saving" ARV's.

About 6 weeks ago, I began to run fevers and had increased and constant rectal pain.
After 2 weeks, I went to see a colo-rectal surgeon who immediately took me up to surgery that day.
What he found was a fairly large rectal ulcer, about an inch by an inch, sitting near the sphincter.  It is eating it's way through the colon wall and into the vagina. Once the wall is breached, there will be cross-contamination and a recto-vaginal fistula is formed.

Side note: I had a recto-vaginal fistula in 1992 due to a botched episiotomy after delivery of my first child. So this is already a "weak" area.

The surgeon drained and debrided the wound and took biopsies.

His plan was to go back in over the next couple of months and do 2 or 3 more surgeries to lay skin grafts to repair the hole.

Three weeks after this initial surgery, I was still running low grade fever and experiencing pain.
I was admitted to the hospital for I.V. antibiotics. 
Due to conflicting pathology reports, we are having the samples sent to an indepentant lab for review.
One sample found CMV in the wound,other samples were negative for all virus and bacteria. There is no evidence (from the blood cultures) of CMV, or anything else, anywhere in the body or blood.
I allowed them to run I.V. gancyclovir for 3 days while in the hospital. While on this BLACK BOX drug, I experienced exploding headaches, nausea, and vomiting, and an increase in liver enzymes.
They blamed all of that on "HIV" and CMV. I had them discontinue the drug, against their "better advisement" to me. I immediately felt better.

Due to my low CD4 count, which was always low while 11 years on the drugs, the surgeon then refused to go back in and do any more surgery.

UNLESS.......I submit to taking the BLACK BOX ARV's that almost killed me the first time around.
He, and no less than 7 other surgeons (and I.D. doctors) attempted to blackmail me into taking these drugs. Every surgeon I saw told me that they would not operate UNLESS I take ARV's.
These doctors looked me right in the face and told me that I was "on my last legs", would "never lived to see my daughter get married", and would be "dead any time now".

We have even had other consults this week since being out of the hospital. One doctor who refused to help told me that eventually the wound would perforate and I would bleed to death.
Thank you very much.

Up until just a few months ago, I was still incredibly active.

My (major) problem now is that I have an open wound, a hole, in the colon that will only get worse and cannot find one ethical surgeon ANYWHERE (so far) to step up to the plate and help repair this issue.

Although these doctors continue to tell me how immune suppressed I am, based on just a CD4 count, all of my other lab work is pretty good. It does not indicate a non-working immune system.

Not to mention, I do not get sick with anything.

At the moment, I am feeling okay, other than the pain. I am home. I am up and moving a lot. We are pursuing many options daily. So far though, we have not found ONE surgeon willing to do the right thing and fix a legitimate surgical problem.

So, I thank you all for your concerns and prayers. Our search continues.

I am alive and well (for the most part) but the situation will continue to worsen and could get desperate quickly if all help is refused. 

My advice: stay far away from the overwhelming evil of the AIDSMafia and consider very strongly before ever taking ARV's. The bullshit, the blackmail, and the terrorism involved in this genocidal scandal of the century is unlike anything I could ever imagine in my wildest dreams.  



  1. Grim beyond description. I hope Karri can find a way of getting better that suits her and will work. How is she going to beat the CMV without appropriate anti-virals?

  2. I think this AIDS denialism has broke out proportion. Well, I don't think anyone in rightest mind couldnt beleive that AIDS doesnt exist even Duesberg himself know for da fact. However, Skepticism is not crime in science, hence Duesberg skepticism about the correction of HI virus with AIDS. He was really opening a scientific debate about Gallo and his collegues with their innovative method of identification of the virus, at which Duesberg wasnt familiar with at that time. Gallo simple opened new avenue in term rapidly identification virus. hence Mutagenomics so on. However, Gallo methods provide some short coming in term of rational design effective treatment to purge the pandemic like it happen to SARS. Because scientist draw the model from the artifical HIV that was not directly isolated for AIDS patients. What need now some Isolate virus in traditional way for AIDS patients. Retrovirus are diverse clades and behaovour defferent in defferent animal model. if we really identify the really virus for human with be the end AIDS. That will allow scients rational design vaccine/drug from the actually HIV form Human that aim to purge the virus. Till then, we still facing huge problem of people dying an avoidable death. The ARVs treatment provide challeges for HIV/AIDS patients to really adherence on treatmet cos the provide more harm than good. Ben referr Bad Science mentioned the impact medication side effect in correction with health outcome. People are taking pills to get better no get sick and if side effects worse then patient dropout of the medication. in case ARVs once patient dropout from the treatment they develop drug resistsnce then die then due oppourtitic deasese. then ppl start to put blame on ARV. Well, I dont knw...we still facing huge task here.

  3. Karri's first post to "AIDS Myth Exposed" April 20th, 2007. It does not say that she "became seriously ill while taking anti-HIV medications" as you write here.

    "I m VERY healthy, never had an opport. infection, and do an all natural approach with everything else."

  4. I know you have an anti-AIDS-dissent agenda on this blog, and I know all your reasons so don’t bother repeating them, but the bottom line is that Karri had lost all quality of life on her AIDS meds, and felt she was at death’s doorstep. She is one of many who have experienced the same, despite the skepticism of readers of this blog who say they have found excellent health on theirs.

    No matter what the powers or non-powers of HIV, should she not have the right to choose her own path, tell her story, express her views about what treatment did to her? I’ve said this before, but I find the ideas put forward on this blog extremely patronizing, reductionist, fundamentalist. HIV’s powers aside, nothing, not even your prized AIDS treatment, is black-and-white. Everybody knows that treatment that works for some kills others. And don’t bother with trotting out the numbers—numbers mean nothing if you’re in the pool of those for whom treatment didn’t work.

    I know I should know better than to chime in here, as discussion has never once in the past proved fruitful, so I’ll just make that point, and leave it at that.

  5. Connie,
    If you'd read Seth's previous posts, you see that he agrees with you on one aspect of your comment (Heck, we all do). That an individual is free to make informed decisions on their health is something we all agree upon. The problem is when people make decisions based on misinformation peddled by the likes of Rasnik, Duesberg, ect...

    Same goes for any other medically related topic. Take cancer, for example. People are free to choose whether or not they will undergo treatment. No one has a problem with that. But, when they refuse to undergo treatment because they are being fooled by, let's say, a vitamin maker or "investigative journalist" into thinking that, say, eating mega doses of vitamins will cure them, then there is a problem. Make sense?

  6. Connie,
    This is the only thing I have ever seen you write that is close to true:

    "AIDS Treatment is not black and white. What works for some does not work for others."

    I paraphrased because not doing so would have shown that you were being "patronizing and reductionist" which would prove you hypocritical.

    With that said, Karri stayed on the SAME meds for 11 years. She AND her doctors were at fault for not CHANGING her meds!!! She probably would have done much better on different meds. Just because SOME ARVs do not work for a patient does NOT mean ALL ARVs will not work!! Instead of at least TRYING different meds after one year of misery, she went for 11 years, became angry and bitter and THAT is why she is in this predicament now.

    Well, that and the fact that you denialists are USING Karri toward pushing your own agenda makes many of you just as culpable in her current misery! Can you live with that? Why not talk her into at least TRYING what doctors who have actually studied medicine and practiced medicine and experienced and seen time and again what happens in this circumstance.

    Do you HONESTLY BELIEVE that these doctors are just being assholes and are lazy and just don't want to do the surgery? OR are they worried she will NOT SURVIVE the surgery?

    You, Connie, are doing Karri a disservice (to say the least) for enabling her horrible, potentially deadly decision!! Karri is very, very sick and in grave danger! She has said so herself. She needs HELP not lies disguised as friendship! Do what is right and talk some sense into her.

    I hope Joe Stokely gets a dose of reality if his wife dies and HOLDS YOU ALL ACCOUNTABLE!!!

    Just so there is no confusion as to who I am,
    J. Todd DeShong

  7. I called a (non-gay, non-drug using) friend of mine yesterday to check how he's doing. He was admitted to hospital 8 years ago close to death. CD4 count 4 with diagnosed PCP. I met him not long after he came out of hospital. He was thin as a rake, couldn't work and looked terrible, thin as a rake and obviously sick.

    Since then he's been on sustiva and truvada (no change in meds yet), CD4 count up at 400, has worked most of the time since, survived non-hodgkins lymphoma and is doing so well his consultant (we share the same doctor) is happy to see him yearly with quarterly checkups led by a specialist nurse. He doesn't suffer any side-effects. That's his story.

    Had he not been put on the ARVs when he was admitted all those years ago he would be long dead. He's happy to take a couple of pills a day and live a reasonable life.

    I sympathise with Karri if she had no choice but to take AZT for a long time. As I said in a blog post, in the western world AZT is not prescribed unless there are no other options available to a patient. I don't believe Karri's only option is a return to AZT combined with say Crixivan and 3TC. There is a plethora of new drugs available that are much easier on the body and like my friend, she could restore her health without suffer debilitating side-effects from her medication. It seems a stark and straightforward choice between life and death.

    As Todd says, "Do you HONESTLY BELIEVE that these doctors are just being assholes and are lazy and just don't want to do the surgery?". We're back to the idea that the ENTIRE MEDICAL PROFESSION has bought into some kind of global conspiracy and invented all of HIV science on a whim or at the behest of an unknown deity operating on behalf of BIG PHARMA ?!?!?!? Does that really stack up?

    PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE go take ARVs and don't die a martyr to your cause.

  8. I wonder why Clark Baker did not saddle up his myriad of attorneys from The Office of Medical and Scientific Justice and ride in and save the day for Ms. Stokely? Surely if he can change the United States Policy on HIV Criminalization in a mere 9 months, he could accomplish getting a doctor to perform life saving surgery!

    BTW, Karri now says her surgery is scheduled for next week. How long do you think it will be before Baker takes credit?

  9. JTD
    Just went and saw her update...

    "Surgery is scheduled for next week.
    Thank you for all of your continued support and prayers!"

    That is good news, I think.

    If she found a legit doc to operate, that is good. If her immune system can sustain the risks for infection, that is good. If she is taking at least anti-virals for the CMV, that is good. If the is taking ART to suppress HIV, that is good.

    But if the surgery is performed by Dr. Rasnick, followed by a regimen of extreme coffee enemas, with light therapy administered by Celia Farber... Then that is not good.

    Hope to see her posting that we are all idiots and she is just fine. I mean that. Sincerely.

  10. Jonathan Barnett is now writing at his blog that he has been so fatigued and energy zapped for months that he can barely do anything. He says that is why he has not blogged consistently for many months. He is too tired to even write.
    That does not sound very good!

  11. Can they really not see that hiv+ denialists acquire "strange" diseases, and hiv- denialists don't?
    Please people, do the math!

  12. Anonymous re Barnett:

    This is exactly why skepticism thrives in the field of HIV/AIDS. Now you try to lump his tiredness symptoms on the work of the nasty virus HIV, when even your own orthodoxy recognises there is no causation. It's tragic that when someone who is HIV+ gets ANY kind of illness it's automatically linked to AIDS by you pseudo diagnosticians. No wonder they live with such stress in their lives, as something as innocuous as the normal winter sniffles evokes a life threatening stress response in them. Chronic stress is recognised as a powerful immune suppressant in it's own right without the need for any virus. And quite frankly I could easily correlate Dr. Todd DeShongs internet diagnosis of Karposi's Sarcoma in Barnett with his current fatigue.

    "In terms of HIV-related issues, CD4 and viral load were not consistently linked with fatigue, though people with more HIV-related symptoms were more likely to have the condition. Studies on comorbid conditions—such as diabetes and hepatitis B or C—were mixed, with some studies finding a connection with fatigue and others showing no connection at all.

    Of all the factors considered, psychological disorders—particularly depression and anxiety—had the strongest and most consistent connection with fatigue. Sleep problems also predicted fatigue. Though the total hours a person slept didn’t have an impact, people who napped during the daytime were more likely to suffer with the problem."

    HIV related fatigue? yes, but it sure ain't the virus itself doing it.

    I'd be very interested to see a study done on the immune function of prisoners on death-row after 10 years of waiting to die.

  13. Re: Anonymous' buttinski on Barnett,
    You wrote:
    "even your own orthodoxy recognises there is no causation."
    Really? Really, truly?
    "Many providers believe that fatigue is one of the most prevalent -- yet under-reported, under-recognized, and under-treated -- aspects of HIV disease. Several studies suggest that most people with HIV/AIDS experience fatigue at some point during their illness, with estimates ranging from less than 50% to more than 80%. The prevalence (rate) of fatigue increases as HIV disease progresses."

    Reiterate: "Increases with disease progression"
    By Barnett's own account, he has been HIV+ for many years and off of meds for (this part always varies per Barnett) for 7 years. You are being disingenuous when you equate his very poor health (HIV+, Bells Palsy still not well after 7 months, extreme clotting disorders)with "the sniffles"! That is a credibility losing statement for you. Also, even the study you provided mentioned anemia as a main factor in extreme fatigue (which is what Barnett is suffering from. Note the word "extreme") With Barnett's coag/hematology issues, anemia could be more of a factor than "siffles".

    Fatigue is multifactorial including hormonal imbalance especially low testosterone which HIV does affect especially people who are a bit older as Barnett is. That coupled with the fact that he does not get enough (if any) exercise is a much bigger issue as to why he cannot resolve the issue. Well, that and the fact that people like you coddle and enable him. Is that really the way someone who cares about another behaves?

  14. I am somewhat mystified. HIV medication does have a number of well-characterised side effects, but despite my close knowledge of them all and the literature on them, I don't know of any that cause chronic large bowel damage and ulceration like Karri appears to have.

    It is tempting for her to blame this on the ARVs, but the facts are that this is a problem that has arisen since she stopped ARVs.

    CMV was isolated from the ulcer - a sign this is CMV colitis, an indicator of advancing immune deficiency.

    How does any of this add up to ARV damage, except in the mind of a denialist?

  15. I think she classifies AZT treatment as chemotherapy. I know AZT was developed as a chemotherapy but always assumed the dosing would be much higher compared to its used in combination therapy.

    I had a look here:

    They do mention that patients on chemotherapy can suffer CMV colitis.

    Under the heading of prognosis I read:

    "In people with healthy immune systems, symptoms usually go away without treatment.
    Symptoms are more severe in those with weakened immune systems. The outcome depends upon the severity of the immune system deficiency and the severity of the CMV infection.
    People with AIDS may have a worse outcome than those with weakened immune systems due to another reason. CMV infection typically affects the entire body, even if patients only have gastrointestinal symptoms. How well a patient does depends on how well the antiviral drugs work."

    Go figure.

    I hope she gets better but its seems unlikely without her taking ARVs and antivirals for the CMV infection. For the life of me I don't understand her wholesale refusal to be treated.

  16. Buttinski Responds.

    "Many providers believe"

    You shot yourself down in the first sentence my friend and expose HIV science for what it really is, a belief system.

  17. YES!

    See, the Orthodoxy is nothing more than a belief system! Just use the word 'believe' and you give yourself away!

    But Anonymous, you seem confused.

    You say you are our friend? How can that be? If you are the friend you say you are, then why do you insult us so?

    Watch your words...every one of them.

  18. Being from the northern US Seth I doubt you can appreciate the nuance in the terminology "my friend".

    Confused? no. I have your number Mr. Kalichman.

  19. Good point.

    Being of the sane and rational, saying that providers believe something does not mean the something is built in beliefs.

    And what exactly is my number, Mr. Anonymous?

  20. "Many providers believe"

    You shot yourself down in the first sentence my friend and expose HIV science for what it really is, a belief system.

    Not really. The belief is perfectly valid if it is the best fitting model for the data. The word "belief" does not always mean a baseless belief, but rather a more accurate word to use than "know", especially with science when new data can change the model.

    We can believe that the moon will still be there tomorrow based on the data that there nothing in the immediate vicinity of our solar system that will change that overnight, thus making that the most reliable model, but to say we "know" it will be there tomorrow is to discount the possibility of the unexpected.

    Science generally does not deal with absolutes for this reason. Denialism tends to use absolutes quite often and to their own embarrassment.

  21. Buttinski had to seize on the word "believe" because he was trying to blame anything EXCEPT HIV for causing fatigue. Yet that sentence unequivocally stated that the "belief" was that HIV itself was causing the fatigue and contradicted his "causation" lie. And why should those providers not believe HIV to be the causation of the fatigue, when all those suffering from fatigue had HIV as the single most common factor they all shared?

    Also, it's most interesting that among all those factors, Buttinski decides all the blame and fault lies with ME ("Dr" DeShong)! And they wonder why I (pretend to) have such an ego. Why shouldn't I when I (allegedly) have the power to cause extreme fatigue on a very late middle aged man in very poor health who does not exercise nor take care of himself? And also I can do all this by NOT doing what Buttikski claimed I did!! Nice logic, Buttinski! I think your new name should be Idiotinski!

  22. So the use of the word "belief" means that something is a "belief system" which therefore is further leapfrogged to mean that it is wrong? And therefore denialism is something "rational" or correct?

    So the "belief" in gravity is wrong? What about the Big Bang? Evolution?

    Holy cow, I thought denialists were idiots but people like this show that they are true retards. As in real retardation. I'm sure his tooth-count supersedes his IQ...

    I "believe" that Clarkie Baker and Celia Farber are nut-jobs.

  23. Still Laughing at YouOctober 4, 2010 at 10:15 PM

    You lot crack me up, AIDSMEDS.COM shows fatigue not to be caused per se by the HIV virus through study after study (remember science).

    Then you try to rebutt it with a statement that "many practictioners believe", then you launch in to overdrive trying to defend your beliefs Vs your own empirical science.

    It really doesn't get any sillier than that and shows the state of play in your rancid little minds.

    All in an attempt to show Barnett is now dying of AIDS because he has fatigue or rather because he disagrees with you.

    Your ethics have not improved one zac since Gallo's seminal "science" papers and your zeal matches the best of fundamental whacko religeons. How sad to see the depths you'll plumb to defend a failing but still lucrative hypothesis.

    I.Q.? in your case it just stands for "I'll Quote", anything that supports your case. Even that lunatic DeShong has more lucid days than you.

  24. "Fatigue cannot be viewed solely as a constitutional symptom of progressive HIV disease. Physicians should seek underlying, treatable causes for fatigue such as depression and anemia and treat these conditions when they are found."

    Give it up you clowns, you're fighting your own publications and looking more like "Dumb and Dumber" by the day.

  25. Lets invent a new disease called "ANYTHING BUT HIV" (but all the symptoms)? Anyways HIV fatigue is just part and parcel of the body fighting an illness. Those of us who are sensible enough to take meds find ourselves much less fatigued as a result.

  26. "Fatigue cannot be viewed solely as a constitutional symptom of progressive HIV disease."

    What does "solely" mean, Anonymous?

    There's something really painful about watching HIV/AIDS denialists trying to demonstrate their reading comprehension skills.

  27. Just knew "Dumbest" would weigh in wagging his tail, licking his arse then cocking his leg against the furniture.

    Guess I'm licked (pun) HIV causes everything then, no exceptions it's an omnipotent entity, all neat and tidy, if your Poz and get ill, from anything whatsoever, it's the virus doing it. I even heard of a guy with AIDS related ingrown toenails, poor man, he's in denial of course.

    Yada Yada Yada Yada

  28. I can't believe I forgot to mention that horrible, awful shirt that Baker is wearing!!
    Notice how it attempts to cover that protruding belly! And those granny~glasses~on~a~chain!!!
    Oh, dear God!!

  29. If you look at the picture of Karri that Seth posted above and compare it to the video of her a couple of weeks ago in which she is discussing the doctors who all "ignored and threatened her", you will notice how much thinner she is now! She is really, really skinny now! Her legs thru her warm up pants are sticks! I wonder how she is doing after her surgery that was supposedly this week?

  30. More quality statements from Toad DeSchlong, bastion of orthodox logic and defender of the faith.

    "I can't believe I forgot to mention that horrible, awful shirt that Baker is wearing!!
    Notice how it attempts to cover that protruding belly! And those granny~glasses~on~a~chain!!!"

    You really need to pick your allies better Seth, they make you look like a fool.

  31. JTD, Clark Baker looks like a fool because he is a fool. He just dresses the part.

    I checked for an update on How Karri may be doing. With AIDS Denialists, no news is anything but good news.

  32. Is she dead? Clark Baker should be strung up by his micropenis if she is dead.

  33. Hey check out what Crazy 'Lawyer' to the AIDS Deniers David Steele is up to.

    Seth, I thought that law schools screened for mental illness? Even the University of online fake lawyers should be more careful.

    Is Steele the most insane AIDS denier lawyer or is Anthony Brink? Tough call.

  34. Anonymous
    No reason to exaggerate about Baker.

    It would seem to me that if Karri was doing well we would know. That anyone would fall into the swirling crap pit of AIDS Denial is just sad. Desperate and fragile people will listen to the craziest of crazies.

    If you see any up dates in Karrie Stokely please do let us know.

  35. What point are you trying to make here, Seth?

    Are you implying that her current medical condition is caused by HIV?

    It seems like you are insinuating that, without actually going on record by saying it.

    Isn't it ironic you are critical of her for denying herself treatment, but you have nothing ill to say of the doctors who are denying her treatment? Even if meds had some benefit, why is it so hard for you to acknowledge there are side effects too, and the individual patient doesn't need to be judged for choosing one side on the balance scale? There's no right or wrong... Its a choice.

    She should just find a doctor who doesn't know about her HIV status, and get the operation done. She's turning this into an 'us verse them' fight, needlessly.

  36. For the record...

    Kari Stokely has HIV infection.

    She has developed a colon lesion that tested positive for CMV and required surgery.

    She most likely has CMV colitis - seen in late stage HIV infection - dare I say AIDS.

    Surgery on her would be very risky -- not just risk for infection but from non-compliance with post-operative instructions. All it takes if for David Crowe to tell her to stop taking antibiotics and do a radical coffee cleanse, and she is dead.

    She refuses HIV treatment because she cannot face AIDS. Her doctors refuse to treat her colon because she cannot face AIDS...the same you are right.

    There is a right and wrong, you see.

    It is wrong to misinform people who then make misinformed choices that can kill them.

    And how about you Tony? How are things in Nashville?

  37. "She should just find a doctor who doesn't know about her HIV status, and get the operation done. She's turning this into an 'us verse them' fight, needlessly."

    Stupefyingly ignorant. Here is a newsflash for you: this is not the first time someone with HIV infection has developed CMV colitis, and it cannot be treated with surgery. It is a manifestation of severe immune deficiency, it occurred frequently prior to any HIV drugs being available and continued to occur in people with AIDS until complete HIV suppression became possible in the mid-1990s. Now the incidence anywhere ART is available is extremely low to non-existent. The "balance" here is between facing a prognosis of 4-12 month survival compared to living a normal lifespan or close to it.

  38. Tony,

    "Even if meds had some benefit, why is it so hard for you to acknowledge there are side effects too, and the individual patient doesn't need to be judged for choosing one side on the balance scale? There's no right or wrong... Its a choice."

    I find it sad that denialists are the ones claiming that we believe there are no side effects. Seth (and every other intelligent person here) acknowledges that there are side effects. For some people certain drugs are intolerable and at that point they should consult their doctor. No one here is saying that a person should not be able to make an informed decision (for or against taking their medication). What we are against is people making MISinformed decisions based on the ramblings of completely unqualified idiots. If Kari, in her right mind and knowing the facts decided not to take ARVs, then fine. The problem is that she is being told that HIV is harmless (or doesn't exist...or both) and that ARVs will kill her, ect... by idiots using fear tactics rather than facts. The saddest part of it all is that those telling her this have no personal stake in this at all. They don't have HIV. They will not expose themselves to the kind of suffering that Kari is experiencing through their own denial.

    So do some ARVs have side effects for some people. Yes. It is all a question of risk vs benefits. Kari appears to have CMV colitis, which is very rare in people with healthy immune systems. Like other herpes viruses, CMV rarely causes life threatening symptoms unless the person is immune-compromised. This is the same thing that happened to Maggiore when she developed disseminated herpes. These things don't happen to immunocompetent people. Sadly, only denialists seem to be incapable of putting two and two together.

    So let me ask you this one simple question: How many HIV- denialists come down with diseases found inpatients with severely compromised immune systems like these strangely extensive herpes-virus infections?

  39. Poodle - what are you talking about? The reason the denialists come down with these strange illnesses is because they don't adequately treat their stresses with the correct wavelengths of love-light. This has been expounded upon by the venerable journalist Celia Farber.

    And if you need further proof, I present to you the expert opinion of the highly qualified Clark Baker who runs the esteemed international organizational Post Box for Medical and Scientific Justice. His quadruple-blind randomized uncontrolled controlled republican studies have shown that Starbucks enemas have alleviated all HIV symptoms in all people not suffering from fake HIV.

    This is exactly the type of expert that patients like Karri Stokely should listen to for their medical advice.

    You, with all your silly "science" kinda stuff and ridiculous concepts like "logic" or "reason" should be ashamed of yourself. It's all overrated.

  40. Anyone know when Karri is going to be around? I have an upcoming appointment with her...

  41. Why do you let vile comments through Seth?

    Dear Grim: since the existence of people like you on planet earth makes me suicidally depressed, you'll be seeing me first, and I have every intention of punching your miserable lights out.

  42. Hey Seth... i'm not anyone from Nashville, that you surmised. I promise.

    I'm a hetero poz guy with a poz girlfriend. To her chagrin, i've never had my labwork done, and wasn't really planning on it.

    NM's response was pretty harsh, but i'd like to thank him/her. It opened my eyes that neg people simply don't get these ailments.

    I guess i sense an incongruity with the dissident movement, because while they say hiv doesn't cause aids, they (dissident poz people) are always discussing about what to do about this ailment, or that ailment. If they were healthy, these ailments shouldn't exist in the first place.

    Its like they are acknowledging something is wrong with their bodies, but aren't acknowledging what is the cause of it.

    I must face the fact that my body is not as strong as it should be. I look good, and don't really get 'sick', but there is something going on. I'm going to get the labwork done, and go from there.

    No matter what my stance is, i do respect this blog, as neither of my posts were censored. I think thats key if you want to convince anyone of anything.

  43. The Grim Reaper comment should be deleted.

  44. NM asked, "Why do you let vile comments through Seth?"

    Tony said it best, "i do respect this blog, as neither of my posts were censored.

    Tony...Thanks for your candid comments. I had thought you might be Tony Lance...but my mistake.

    Keep an open mind. Find out what is going on and address it. Keep yourself looking and feeling good.
    Thanks again,

  45. I am the only one who does any sort of "deleting."

  46. Seth
    I read that Kari Stokely has died. I saw it on a facebook page, but now it seems to be gone. I am doing what I can to find it again. This is really sad. The AIDS Denialists are probably trying to figure out how to cover it up. But ultimately the truth will come out.

    If anyone has verifiable info, either way, it would be good to confirm.

    But if what I saw is true, I feel bad for her kids. What are they to think? What will Baker and the others who helped kill her have to say now? Will her husband realize what they and he did??
    So sad, really.

  47. And the grave-dancing has started guys are umbelievable!

  48. Karri Stokely posted to her blog on Monday, so any rumors of her demise are greatly exaggerated.

  49. The lady is dying of AIDS.
    It does not get any more real than that.
    I am not sure we will ever know what happens to her. AIDS deniers and her family will not advertise her condition. We will, however, know that they are done using her in their sick game when some other white woman with 2 kids suddenly appears on the Rethinking AIDS website.

  50. They have a black gay man instead, Emery Taylor, check out the Rethinking AIDS website. They're also on twitter, demonstrating that you can blame the victim in less than 140 characters:

    "If cancer is 'purely man-made', according to scientists, what then, is the cause of the AIDS-defining cancers?"

  51. Wow, poor Karri isn't even gone yet and they've already found someone else. The sad thing is that denialists will never stop to ask themselves why their poster-children continue to die off from diseases that are extremely rare in immunocompetent people.

    I wonder what will happen when Emery starts coming down with the same symptoms Karri, Maggiore, and countless others have had? Have you guys already begun to rationalize this away?

  52. In defence of this poor girl can anyone answer this. How do you know that these people live any longer on the new drugs. Many people used to live for less than a year on the old drugs. So it is reported that they now live longer. People have not taken any drugs and lived since the first days of HIV. Its a no win situation really because if she dies people will say it is because she never took any drugs. If she died and had taken drugs, they will say well she lived a lot longer because of the new drugs. This is the important thing that I think everyone should take note of. Because no one is allowed to question or test this properly, we will never know the answer to this question. Its a closed off area now. That is why following proper scientific protocol, and being able to openly question methods in a proper unbiased and scientific manner is very important. Going back to the times when scurvy was about, and the horrible treatments given, because the science community refused to believe it was nutrition and was a infectious disease. Have we learned our lesson from this or are we going down the same route that they went which included biased research, and an extra 2 million unecessary deaths.


    "I received news this morning that Karri is in hospice care with a bad pneumonia infection...The person who told me asked me not to say anything about it, to keep it quiet."

    Warning: the words are angry and extremely ugly. But then the hypocrisy of someone using pictures to claim health, persuading others to make the same misinformed choice and then covering up their illness is ugly too. There is someone on the House of Numbers Facebook page right now proclaiming how healthy they are six months after stopping treatment.

  54. Well, she died. I spoke with her via Facebook last year when I was first diagnosed and she refused to answer any questions I might have had about her own uncertainty. Skepticism is one thing but refusing to even doubt your own certainty or question it points to a personal inability to accept or face a consequence or result. All she said to me was that she was sorry that I has tested positive on one of those false tests and pointed me to all the usual suspects-the websites and links featuring docs and faces we've come to associate with the "Rethinking" movement. It is true ARVS can take a toll on the body and Karri started taking them at a time when they hadn't been as sophisticated as they are now. She could've kept on living had she not fallen victim to "Rethinking". I am three months into ATRIPLA and I can tell you that my numbers have shown significant results. Frequent follow-ups with your HIV doctor will reveal any adverse inside effects of the drugs and there are other combinations and programs if one treatment regime does not work. It is is experimental and it is frightening. If someone chooses not to follow the ARVS route then that is their choice but they shouldn't assume that because they have made a choice that somehow everyone else of being coaxed or tricked into a conspiracy. Quietly make your choices and share whatever secrets you've discovered with your complementary therapies. I know Christine Maggiore shared recipes and diet on her podcasts that are beneficial to anyone. Why politicize your choice and cause another dimension of divisiveness and doubt within a diagnosis that is already fraught with such uncertainty and a social history of destruction?