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Denying AIDS: Conspiracy Theories, Pseudoscience, and Human Tragedy

Seeking Stories of AIDS Denialism

Have you or someone you know been harmed by AIDS Denialism? If you, or someone you care about, have been advised to stop taking HIV meds, ignore HIV test results, purchase a 'natural' cure etc., please email me.

aidsandbehavior@yahoo.com

All information will be kept confidential.

Wednesday, September 1, 2010

AIDS Deniers Speak Out in Chicago

August 31, 2010
 by Gary Barlow

UPDATE: Reprinted in Edge, Boston 

CHICAGO – Almost 26 years after the HIV virus was established as the cause of AIDS and some 15 years after drug treatments developed out of that discovery led to dramatic drops in AIDS mortality rates in the U.S., some people still propagate the belief that HIV doesn’t cause AIDS and that the drugs used to treat it should be avoided.
Those beliefs were aired at a panel discussion sponsored by Knowledge and Wisdom Productions at the Illinois Institute of Technology Aug. 28. The panel included two AIDS denialists, authors Britnee Burke and Keidi Obi Awadu, and two people who disputed their arguments, epidemiologist Yaa Simpson, of the Association of Clinical Trial Services, and author and activist Ida Byther-Smith. Less than 20 people attended the discussion.
The HIV virus is the most heavily researched virus in medical history. Photo courtesy NIH
“People falsely believe that AIDS is a disease while in fact today it is used as a self-defining complex of diseases, symptoms and definitions,” Awadu said.
Burke, who said she tested HIV-positive 17 years ago and has not taken anti-HIV medications, compared belief in AIDS to religious belief.
“My belief – HIV is a lie,” she said.

Those assertions and others were refuted by Byther-Smith and Simpson.
“We can see a correlation when people take (anti-HIV) medications,” Simpson said. “We see less deaths.”
Byther-Smith told her story, of how she learned she was HIV-positive after being unknowingly infected by her then-husband. After it developed into AIDS, she was rushed to a hospital emergency room, where medical personnel did not expect her to live.
“I heard the nurse when I came in say, ‘She came in through the emergency room, but she’ll go out through the morgue,’” Byther-Smith said. “I was given up for dead.”
But the antiretroviral drugs dismissed as dangerous and misguided by Awadu and Burke saved her life, Byther-Smith said.
“So here I am. I’m living,” she said, detailing the AIDS medications she’s taken since then. “For the last 10 years my viral load has been undetectable.”
Byther-Smith refuted another statement by Awadu, that anal sex causes the illnesses associated with AIDS.
“Sperm was not intended to go into the anus,” Awadu said.
But Byther-Smith, describing herself as “a Christian woman,” said she was infected not by anal sex but by a husband who later admitted that he was infected through affairs he hadn’t disclosed to her.
“Everybody who has this disease is not gay and everybody who has this disease is not having anal sex,” she said. “I know this to be true.”
Simpson displayed graphs showing AIDS prevalence, incidence and mortality rates in Chicago, saying the overwhelming statistics collected and studied here and around the world refute the “AIDS conspiracy” arguments of denialists such as Awadu and Burke.
“This cannot all be lies,” Simpson said.
AIDS denialists have been around since the earliest days of the epidemic. But once effective therapies targeting the HIV virus made it possible for people living with AIDS to live normal lives – in countries where use of those drugs is widespread – prominent scientific critics refuted their earlier denials and questions and acknowledged that HIV is the common factor in AIDS.
One prominent HIV/AIDS doctor, Joseph Sonnabend, was at one time a skeptic of HIV’s role in the disease, but after seeing the effect of antiretroviral drugs engineered specifically to combat HIV, he refuted that stance.
“Some individuals who believe that HIV plays no role at all in AIDS have implied that I support their misguided views on AIDS causation by including inappropriate references to me in their literature and on their web sites,” Sonnabend has written. “I have successfully treated hundreds of AIDS patients with antiretroviral medications, and have no doubt that HIV plays a necessary role in this disease.”
Another denialist often cited by Awadu and others, molecular and cell biologist Peter Duesberg, has been heavily criticized by his peers – as long ago as 1993, the then-editor of Science, refusing Duesberg’s repeated demands to publish articles critical of the settled acceptance that HIV causes AIDS, dismissed Duesberg’s theories.
“He forfeited the right to expect answers by his rhetorical technique,” John Maddox wrote. “Evidence that contradicts his alternative drug hypothesis is...brushed aside.”
At the panel discussion, Chicago Pastor Roger Ford, who is HIV-positive, strongly criticized the effort by Awadu, Burke and others to dissuade people from getting tested for HIV and to avoid HIV medications when they’re appropriate.
“It concerns me today that we speak that there’s no such thing as this disease,” Ford said. “We’re not becoming educated. We’re telling things that are not true. Young people are dying... Don’t tell a person not to go be tested.”

49 comments:

  1. I'm glad you posted this, Seth. I saw this also and a couple of things stood out to me.

    One was that "less than 20 people attended". That further supports what I have been documenting for the past few months and that is AIDS "Dissidents" are not increasing in numbers.
    It makes me happy to see that most intelligent people see thru the "arguments" and lack of facts that support "dissident" arguments.

    Also, it was interesting to see a couple of dissident names I did not know about. Two more people to check out so I can punch holes in their agruments.

    I have already disproven most all them already:
    Baker, Bauer, Scheff, Farber, Barnett, Crowe, Esmay.

    Bring on the next wave!
    JTD

    ReplyDelete
  2. JTD
    There are more of these loonies than we know. One of the funniest things is when I talk to people on the west coast and they think AIDS denialism is a New York thing and people in New York think it is a California thing. What surprises people is that there are Denialist groups all over the place. I wonder if these Chicago Deniers are connected to Maniotis? I hope not, or they may not be around long.

    ReplyDelete
  3. Great news from scandinavia :

    "The Norwegian company Bionor Pharma has presented the results of a survey which proves that the company has developed a therapeutic hivvaksine still active seven years after immunization.

    The results were presented via a poster presentation during AIDS2010 Conference held in Vienna in July, and attracted great attention.
    - It means, "said Birger Sørensen, who is responsible for vaccine site in Bionor Pharma, we have managed to develop a vaccine that creates good, active immune cells with long life.

    Sorensen emphasizes that this is an immunization that specifically strengthens the immune system against HIV. He explains further that the vaccine consists of parts of the virus that the immune system recognizes. - You can say that with the vaccine has made pathogens more easily visible to the immune system, which therefore eases can mobilize against infection.
    Now Bionor Pharma thus proving that the immune activation that has been given to the works in at least seven years.

    Successful attempts
    The reason is as follows: In collaboration with Professor Dag Kvale at Oslo University Hospital, Ullevål conducted Bionor Immuno - which is a subsidiary of Bionor Pharma - an attempt by the immunization of 40 HIV positive in 2003. The experiment has been described as very successful, so successful in fact that most of the participants could take time off from treatment with antiretroviraler in average 31 months without leading to any deterioration in their health condition.

    This year, from January to June, has 26 of the same patients going through a belt munis call for new tests. At the same time have therefore undertaken measurements proves that the strengthening of the immune system, which was the result of the first immune activation in 2003 are still responding. The results of the new tests will be released in September 2010.

    - For HIV-positive, these results are highly significant, says Sørensen.
    - It means that they can have longer therapy-free periods, which will help increase the quality of life, reduce the side effects of drugs and reduce the risk of resistance development. - For the community to an effective therapeutic vaccine means reduced costs and reduced use of medicines. I think this will be a part of future treatment, "said Birger Sørensen to Positive.

    Attracted attention
    The presentation attracted attention in Vienna. So much so that Bionor Pharma as well as post the presentation also got to participate in an oral presentation on therapeutic vaccines. This experience Sørensen as very encouraging, not least because Bionor thus be able to reap the recognition in the international medical specialists. The representatives of the U.S. health authorities were present and tilkjennegav their interest, "says Sørensen.

    He also notes that the work performs Bionor Pharma is supported by the Norwegian Research Council, but funded primarily through the company's own funds. - We need support for the work ahead, he says, and we need support to undertake more and larger studies internationally.

    I hope he will be easier now for Vienna, when it was to make contact with potential partners in this field."

    And at same time breaking news comes from Israel : http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/news/hebrew-u-researchers-develop-treatment-to-kill-hiv-cells-1.311823

    What will the denialists do if a cure is found,Seth? Would they still deny that the virus is behind AIDS and continue or would they finaly accept the facts?Do you think some of the hiv positive denialists would still refuse the cure and rather die of AIDS than accept that they where wrong?

    ReplyDelete
  4. Great Deja-vue from Scandinavia. We've all heard the hyperbole from AIDS conferences which all end with the same lines. "More money is needed".

    27 years in to the AIDS crisis we've still got nothing of substance, just breakthrough after breakthrough after breakthrough, I'd have thought that by now the most studied virus in history which has been mapped and probed in "exquisite detail" would have divulged its secrets, especially as it has only got an 8 killerbyte (pun) genome. Such is the state of play though that in reality there's no vaccine, no cure no nothing. I may DENY HIV, you lot DENY REALITY and are cloistered in your own world of backslapping breakthroughs that yield precisely.........zip.

    Next time you're at a conference, sponsored generously by whichever pharmaceutical company, getting fatter on genetically modified canapes, ask yourself just what have you really acheived, apart from your comfortable lifestyles.

    ReplyDelete
  5. "I'd have thought that by now the most studied virus in history which has been mapped and probed in "exquisite detail" would have divulged its secrets, especially as it has only got an 8 killerbyte (pun) genome."

    Actually it is closer to 9.5Kb. Secondly, just because the genetic sequence is known does NOT mean that all the biological properties and interactions of each resulting protein with host components are known. Granted anonymous, with your extensive knowledge of junior high virology you've probably deduced every nuance of HIV. Don't hold out on us. Come claim your big fat Pharma-check if you have (I'm getting 50k just for this post...Ka-Ching!).

    "Such is the state of play though that in reality there's no vaccine, no cure no nothing."

    No cure yet, no and while there are promising results recently in terms of vaccines they aren't close to usable on a wide scale. However, the research has yielded drugs that have turned HIV into a manageable disease. I suppose to you that's "nothing" but I'm fairly certain you have far less to show for it.

    " I may DENY HIV, you lot DENY REALITY"

    You are doing both. We deny nothing. We accept the data that is reproducible. You simply deny what you are incapable of understanding. Sad really. Perhaps if you took a few courses in virology these things would start to make a bit more sense to you and you'd have an easier time with them.

    "Next time you're at a conference, sponsored generously by whichever pharmaceutical company, getting fatter on genetically modified canapes, ask yourself just what have you really acheived, apart from your comfortable lifestyles."

    Ka-Ching! I just got my big pharma-check card mailed to me the moment this post appeared! I suppose for you it is easier to think of grand conspiracies where anyone that does not agree with your misinformed ideas must be in the pocket of Big Pharma. The truth is simply that you do not grasp biology. No shame in that. It can be a complicated subject and not everyone has the mental fortitude to understand it. That doesn't make for a good conspiracy though, does it?

    ReplyDelete
  6. Nope, nothing has been achieved. Well, unless you count the fact that those horrible, toxic ARVs (the ones that kill every single cell in the human body, according to Liam Scheff) have literally brought people back from the brink of death, extended life expectancies by 20+ years and made this a chronic manageable disease. NAW, let's not count that!

    Oh, and let's not count the fact that HIV tests (the ones that are "multi~reactive and test postive for over 70 proteins" according to the deniers) have all but wiped out HIV transmission via blood transfusions and have all but wiped out HIV transmissions to hemophiliacs. NAW, let's not count that!

    God, HIV science is such a failure!
    JTD

    ReplyDelete
  7. Have another canape Poodles

    ReplyDelete
  8. The saddest part of dogmatists like Poodle Stomper is that they form a belief system early in their careers and then spend the rest of their lives attempting to make the facts fit, rather than looking at the facts and forming an opinion based on them.

    While you are stuck in that mindset, you are closed to any rational thought on a given subject. Hence the "Belief" that HIV causes AIDS is blinding you to the obvious flaws in the paradigm. It is no different to religeous or political beliefs.

    Hence you can have a scientist, vastly qualified in molecular biology, virology or any other ology who believes in God. Even though there is not a shred of evidence to support that, conversely he may have decidedly right wing fascist politics, when common sense would dictate the flaws in that thinking. Does that invalidate his science? or at least question his ability to think objectively about that science?

    In Poodle Stompers case I imagine he believes avidly in HIV/AIDS while trotting off to church on Sunday to pray for the emancipation of Idi Amin.

    Skewed as the research has been, there is still ample evidence to be found that blows holes right to the core of HIV/AIDS. You swallowed Gallo's fallacy at the start and have been attempting to make it true ever since, even while admitting that his original papers were falsified. Statement like "We've learned so much since then", or "Modern research has resolved those issues", simply display that you beaver away madly attempting to prop up a failed proposition.

    Amen

    ReplyDelete
  9. Luke
    Are you ok?

    "there is still ample evidence to be found that blows holes right to the core of HIV/AIDS"

    How about a couple examples...and please nothing from Nessie Hunters and Glowing Raccoon Aliens

    ReplyDelete
  10. Seth, show me the one paper showing that the non-specific, polyreactive test kits that everyone test positive on and that have never been approved by the FDA prove that HIV=AIDS=death. References please, and no PubMed contests! Epidemiology proves AIDS can’t be an infection because HIV has never been isolated and it’s all caused by poppers because Gallo was a fraud. If he wasn’t still alive he would have recanted on his deathbed by now, like Montagnier did on youtube. There are over 2400 highly growing scientists, homeopaths, fish slappers and dowsers who have signed a petition to Science magazine to retract the fraudulent photos of cell debris that no-one noticed until Janine Roberts did her research like a modern day Galileo! . There has never been an EM of HIV they’re all photoshopped. Also there haven’t been any AIDS deaths in South Africa because there is no gold standard for HIV tests and blacks test false positive 20 times more often than whites, like Magic Johnson who is really negative. It’s all lies by the racist AIDS Inc the AIDS Mafia shills selling AZT which was too toxic for cancer chemotherapy (it’s got a skull and crossbones on the label) and killed a whole generation of gay men, and pharmasluts killed the rest by being mean to dissidents – even though they refuse to debate.
    And the Padian and Rodgriguez studies show no AIDS in 1 billion disco couples having kinky sex for a million years and no-one got sick until someone got an enema and got Gay Bowel Syndrome. And the US has had 1 million cases of HIV every year since Columbus, unlike Africa which has the Bangui definition and its all poverty and malaria and tropical diseases. AIDS is really untreated syphilis which isn’t an STD either and it’s a category not an illness, a syndrome not a disease, just a new name for old diseases because antibodies mean immunity. You can win $50,000 from the estates of Christine Maggiore (who tested HIV negative, as well as positive and indeterminate) and another $50,000 from the editors of Continuum and the fact you haven’t proves they didn’t all die of the rapidly crumbling AIDS paradigm. And you can’t find HIV in people with AIDS and no-one with HIV gets AIDS unless they do anal douching or take Bactrim. Or are haemophiliacs loaded to the eyeballs on Factor VIII but they were going to die anyway because just about anything can cause immunosuppression especially vaccines which prove there’s no virus, just a harsh overly deterministic diagnosis and a nocebo effect from the voodoo curse and any disease is called AIDS these days just ask Audrey Serrano, who was killed by high dose AZT and bone pointing till she went on highly addictive HAART. The AIDS establishment destroyed Galileo Duesberg’s career by ad hominem and Gallo didn’t even get peer reviewed. The CDC kept rewriting the definitions to keep the money flowing in. What’s wrong with asking questions? Why won’t you revel your real identity? Why do I still wet the bed? Buy my book! I answer everything there and pose unanswerable questions! I have lots of tables and over 1 billion references from every obscure journal published before 1983. You have a conflict of interest!

    ReplyDelete
  11. AIDS Denier posing as SnoutSeptember 7, 2010 at 7:37 AM

    Viruses always infect both genders equally andTB bacteria make you test HIV positive and anyway HIV is endogenous...errr exogenous...wait whats the difference again...? Bone pointing causes AIDS, except for those who find out they are HIV+ only after the symptoms have shown, they must be druggies. And we are not published because we are censored. Nature, Science, the BB fu@#$%g C and the New York Times censor dissident information and are complicit in the genocide of gays and blacks. It is a mistake to confuse science with medicine and EM’s of HIV are contaminated by cellular proteins. The virus has never been purified like Montagnier admitted after he got the Nobel. There are over 70 different factors that make you test positive to p24 which is a normal cellular protein and a HERV, which has never been micrographed in the bloodstream and which is the answer to the AIDS Hoax! No doctor has ever got AIDS and Popovic admitted that the cause of AIDS has never been identified according to Koch’s Postulates and Medical Hypotheses and other respected mainstream journals like JPandS. And the Lancet 2006 ART cohort study showed the black box drugs cause CERTAIN DEATH and We can be exposed to HIV many times… and you can live forever if you just move to Canada. None of the predictions have come true and Professor Giraldo and Nobel Prizewinners like Eleni Eleopulous Papadopulos proved you have to dilute blood 400 times because having so few T cells they’ve each got their own name is no problem at all unless you get sperm up your date.

    ReplyDelete
  12. AIDS Denier posing as SnoutSeptember 7, 2010 at 7:43 AM

    NOTE: This and the previous comment were submitted as 'Snout'. This guy is actually close to psychotic. I would have discarded the comments, but they are classic. He mentions rewards from Maggiore and Continuum Magazine...all of these people died of AIDS. Please keep sharp objects away from this one!
    ________________________________________________

    Seth, show me the one paper showing that the non-specific, polyreactive test kits that everyone test positive on and that have never been approved by the FDA prove that HIV=AIDS=death. References please, and no PubMed contests! Epidemiology proves AIDS can’t be an infection because HIV has never been isolated and it’s all caused by poppers because Gallo was a fraud. If he wasn’t still alive he would have recanted on his deathbed by now, like Montagnier did on youtube. There are over 2400 highly growing scientists, homeopaths, fish slappers and dowsers who have signed a petition to Science magazine to retract the fraudulent photos of cell debris that no-one noticed until Janine Roberts did her research like a modern day Galileo! . There has never been an EM of HIV they’re all photoshopped. Also there haven’t been any AIDS deaths in South Africa because there is no gold standard for HIV tests and blacks test false positive 20 times more often than whites, like Magic Johnson who is really negative. It’s all lies by the racist AIDS Inc the AIDS Mafia shills selling AZT which was too toxic for cancer chemotherapy (it’s got a skull and crossbones on the label) and killed a whole generation of gay men, and pharmasluts killed the rest by being mean to dissidents – even though they refuse to debate.
    And the Padian and Rodgriguez studies show no AIDS in 1 billion disco couples having kinky sex for a million years and no-one got sick until someone got an enema and got Gay Bowel Syndrome. And the US has had 1 million cases of HIV every year since Columbus, unlike Africa which has the Bangui definition and its all poverty and malaria and tropical diseases. AIDS is really untreated syphilis which isn’t an STD either and it’s a category not an illness, a syndrome not a disease, just a new name for old diseases because antibodies mean immunity. You can win $50,000 from the estates of Christine Maggiore (who tested HIV negative, as well as positive and indeterminate) and another $50,000 from the editors of Continuum and the fact you haven’t proves they didn’t all die of the rapidly crumbling AIDS paradigm. And you can’t find HIV in people with AIDS and no-one with HIV gets AIDS unless they do anal douching or take Bactrim. Or are haemophiliacs loaded to the eyeballs on Factor VIII but they were going to die anyway because just about anything can cause immunosuppression especially vaccines which prove there’s no virus, just a harsh overly deterministic diagnosis and a nocebo effect from the voodoo curse and any disease is called AIDS these days just ask Audrey Serrano, who was killed by high dose AZT and bone pointing till she went on highly addictive HAART. The AIDS establishment destroyed Galileo Duesberg’s career by ad hominem and Gallo didn’t even get peer reviewed. The CDC kept rewriting the definitions to keep the money flowing in. What’s wrong with asking questions? Why won’t you revel your real identity? Why do I still wet the bed? Buy my book! I answer everything there and pose unanswerable questions! I have lots of tables and over 1 billion references from every obscure journal published before 1983. You have a conflict of interest!

    ReplyDelete
  13. Ah, Luke,

    "The saddest part of dogmatists like Poodle Stomper is that they form a belief system early in their careers...

    Actually, I've read the fundamental papers dealing with HIV from when it was first discovered to where it's receptor/coreceptor usage was worked out and beyond. What's more, I understood them. This is not because I "form[d] a belief system early in [my] career" but rather because I understand the papers in question, their results and what said results mean. I doubt the same could be said for you. You'll have a chance to prove me wrong next paragraph, though.


    "While you are stuck in that mindset, you are closed to any rational thought on a given subject..."

    Fantastic! Then please do tell what these "obvious flaws" are! If you're going to mis-cite papers, please do read and understand them first because odds are that I, Snout, or others here already have and we will call you on use of the same tired denialist BS. The question is, if/when shown wrong, will you admit your errors or will you simply employ other denialist tactics like goal post shifting and subject-changing to avoid admitting you were incorrect in your claim?


    "Hence you can have a scientist, vastly qualified in molecular biology, virology or any other ology who believes in God..."

    The issue of whether or not a diety exists is irrelevant to the issue of HIV. The evidence for HIV has been weighed by the scientific community, comprised of both theists and atheists. Other than the handful of cranks in denialist circles, HIV is accepted as the causative agent of AIDS (of course that could change if reliable evidence proved otherwise).


    "In Poodle Stompers case I imagine he believes avidly in HIV/AIDS while trotting off to church on Sunday to pray for the emancipation of Idi Amin."

    You have a wild and wrong imagination. This appears to be a trend for you. I'd be very careful of jumping to conclusions like that and, without evidence, assuming them to be correct. This is the opposite of science.


    "Skewed as the research has been, there is still ample evidence to be found that blows holes right to the core of HIV/AIDS...Statement like "We've learned so much since then", or "Modern research has resolved those issues", simply display that you beaver away madly attempting to prop up a failed proposition.

    Very well. As I stated before, then please bring all of this "ample evidence" to light. I'm willing to bet that it will consist mostly of regurgitating back the same long ago debunked denialist myths but go for it! Again, though, I have to ask; if/when your claims are shown to be nothing more than the result of your own misunderstanding of the science, will you you be able to admit being wrong?

    P.S. Statement like "We've learned so much since then", or "Modern research has resolved those issues" indicates that science is NOT (as denialists seem to beleive) the result of one paper and that science is NOT a series of complete discoveries in a row but rather that science is ever building on itself and evidence is constantly weighed. We have learned a lot about gravity since it was proposed. We've learned a lot about our universe, physics, chemistry, ect... This applies to all fields.

    (Ka-Ching)

    ReplyDelete
  14. Luke,
    If you read a bit more extensively, you might find that many scientists are atheists or agnostics (see Pharyngula or Jerry Coyne for a start). Even if a scientist does believe in God, how does that equate with HIV Science?

    However, you are a bit hypocritical. If you really read your statements as well as fake Snouts's, you would see just where the real paradigm lies and that the denialists rely much more heavily on faith! Well, faith and lies, lies and more lies!
    JTD

    ReplyDelete
  15. I finally got a little spare time to look into the two panel members who represented the denialist arguments.

    1. "Author" Britnee Burke: When googled, I only found her facebook page!

    2. Keidi Obi Awadu: UHM, where to start? How about starting with his favorable representation of Ron Paul and his unfavorable comments on President Obama? Yeah, he actually called into question "seemingly thinking Blacks..." and "warned us repeatedly about the rise of assimilationist and accommodating Negro leadership".

    From those two statements, Keidi seems like a very self righteous, "I'm right at all costs" kind of person. Radical and favoring the side of the extreme no matter the cost. Reminds me of the way Liam Scheff is so anti~every~establishment! Radical for the sake of radical destroys credibility.

    His biography at this website says he is the father of "three beautiful African princesses" and yet thru his extreme AIDS Denialist views, he does not represent Africans from Africa (his daughters were born in the states, as was Keidi.)

    Here are the two most disturbing parts:
    "My father was the noted industrial chemist George Howard . As such, I am well versed and extensively published in such areas as culture, history, ethnicity & society, reproductive biology, health & nutrition, science & technology, as well as the practical application of information technologies."

    So, because his father was a noted chemist, Keidi claims to be not only "well versed" but also "extensively published" in every issue under the sun! WOW! You do realize that someone who claims to have much knowledge in every subject, really has very little knowledge in any one subject!

    Also, this is a bit egotistical and scary:
    "Within the African American community, I have become a widely referenced source to counter the misinformation surrounding HIV/AIDS, sexually transmitted diseases and reproductive issues."

    He fits with the other AIDS Deniers I have studied as far as ego goes!
    JTD

    ReplyDelete
  16. JTD
    Such a service. You have now wasted more time on these crazy bastards in Chicago than they are clearly worth. Nevertheless, the connection between deialism and tea baggers continues to interest me...
    So thanks again...
    By the way, I think Rand Paul is way ahead in the polls... KY could use some help!

    ReplyDelete
  17. I know what you meant by "wasting time" on the crazies, but I disagree. The more they are exposed for their radical thoughts and crazy egos, the less reputable they become. Also, as I have proven time and again, the AIDS Deniers do not look into the backgrounds of other Deniers, they blindly accept them into the fold.

    Also, it's fun for me!
    JTD

    ReplyDelete
  18. JTD
    And you are, of course, right again.

    Truth is, Joe Newton misses the days of leading Crowe and Bauer around on a string.

    Exposing each and every one of these creeps is worth the time.

    Thanks for caring enough to take the time.

    Seth (and Joe)

    ReplyDelete
  19. Ah Seth of course it's worth the time, after all you are paid for it remember.

    ReplyDelete
  20. Umm, I should come clean and point out that it was me who wrote that specimen of denialist rantorrhoea above. I was trying to help Luke out with his "ample evidence to be found that blows holes right to the core of HIV/AIDS".

    Damn that Poe's Law!

    http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Poe's_Law

    ...This Keidi Obi Awadu character - is he the same one who claimed that Jesse Jackson was involved in the assassination of Martin Luther King?

    http://www.whale.to/b/keidi_awadu.html

    He's also a great fan of Ron Paul:

    http://www.ronpaulwarroom.com/?p=7765

    You can read Britnee Burke's book on Amazon (click on the "Look Inside" button, if you dare):

    http://www.amazon.com/What-If-Brittnee-Burke/dp/1438230605

    Apparently this one's not a "Poe", but like I say, it can be hard to tell.

    ReplyDelete
  21. Snout, thanks for finding BritTnee. I searched with only one T, maybe that's why she did not come up. Oh dear, I am looking over her book on Amazon now. UHM, she has the book in two forms:

    1. Screenplay ~ HUH? (Brent Leung influence, perhaps? His first movie was a great piece of fiction!)

    2. Novel ~ Am I wrong, or is the word "novel" meant for narrative (fiction?) I think it is!

    I hope her writing gets better. Her second sentence says:

    "What If? (Screenplay), is the results a study done..."

    NICE! She left out the word "of" AND there is no subject/verb agreement i.e. screenplay (the subject) is singular and results (the verb) is plural!

    In the "conclusion" of her screenplay, Brittnee says she has seen (and lists) several HIV/AIDS themed movies, and says:

    "I BELIEVE (emphasis mine) these movies were done out of ignorance of HIV and served in part to 'beat the drums.'"

    Unfortunately, her "belief" is not adequate proof and she lists only two movies that were "based" on a real incidence. The others were complete fiction and dealt with death, albeit death by AIDS. She even mentions the movie "Outbreak" which was 100% fiction and did not even deal with AIDS!!

    Look, how can you take someone seriously, especially as a journalist, who writes about science as a screenplay and as a "novel" and who has crappy grammar and left out a word in her second sentence and then lists fictional movies about AIDS and one movie not even about AIDS to make some lame point? And who lists movies anyway to support a supposed intelligent argument? OH, I know, a "journalist" who is obviously trying to get a movie made, not trying to seriously construct a serious argument about a serious subject!

    When are the deniers going to stop their Religious Worship of people who have no clue about science, and listen to those who have spent years studying this subject and have years of practical experience?
    JTD

    ReplyDelete
  22. Clarkie now writes about the Benaissi Germany trial. HILARIOUS! He uses it to promote himself again, implying that OMSJ is actually more than a post box! He says it is comprised of "scientists, investigators, and attorneys"!!!! HAHAHAHAHHA!! (see below) He is offended when people ignored his retarded pleas for attention...



    "OMSJ made repeated attempts to contact Ms. Benaissi and her attorneys in the months leading up to her trial. Although OMSJ’s involvement in other HIV-related trials resulted in prosecutors or courts dismissing all HIV-related charges, neither Benaissi nor her attorneys responded to free offers for assistance from OMSJ’s scientists, investigators or attorneys. She was convicted not because she was HIV+ but because her attorneys had no clue about how to defend the case.

    OMSJ is currently involved in 40+ other HIV-related civil and criminal cases in the US and Canada and awaits the trial that should have occurred in Germany.

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  23. When are the Truthers going to stop their worship of a failed paradigm?

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  24. Anonymous:
    What's a "Truther"? Someone educated who understands science? Someone who believes that President Obama was born in America and isn't a Muslim? Someone who believes in the reality of global warming? Someone who understands what the rest of the world does - that HIV causes AIDS and although there is no cure yet, antiretrovirals have made great progress?

    I guess then everyone is a "Truther". Except for the extreme cult fringe of idiotic conspiracy-theory lunatics and insignificant retards who make themselves feel important highlighted by the geniuses like Clarkie Baker.

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  25. JTD...this time you have gone too far. Those HIV drugs are destroying you. Please, stop! All you are proving is that everyone needs a porpoise in life.
    http://dissidents4dumbees.blogspot.com/2010/09/46-so-fabulous-its-sick.html

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  26. Earth to Perthians, come in please:

    http://www.aegis.org/news/lt/2010/LT100904.html
    HIV virus used to cure a genetic blood disorder

    ReplyDelete
  27. Fake Snout DenialistSeptember 16, 2010 at 11:07 PM

    Fake Snout commented..And this is unedited...

    Seth, I hope you can back up your accusations with cetaceans from the literature.

    ReplyDelete
  28. Sounds like Karri Stokely has been diagnosed with CMV colitis:

    http://naturalnews.tv/v.asp?v=AF7CB72046BBD69FB245925C576CFAD1

    About 22 minutes in.

    My first direct experience of AIDS was when a friend was diagnosed with CMV colitis in 1992, he hadn't been tested for HIV so hadn't known he was positive. CMV retinitis followed in little more than a year, he went blind, and died in 1994.

    There is a ton of evidence that ART improves immunity to CMV, not least the fact that CMV colitis and retinitis are so rare now. But according to Liam, the fact that Kari has CMV colitis now but never developed it on ART is your fault, Seth. And John Moore's fault, etc etc.

    ReplyDelete
  29. That is too bad about Karri Stockely. Though not unexpected.

    I will be in Tampa later this week. Seriously.. If I thought there was a chance to help shake her out of denial I would reach out. But there is no way that can happen.

    Too bad really. This poor lady has kids.

    As for Liam Sheff..he is a crazy bastard in need of something to occupy his time. Maybe there is an opening for Professional Photoshopper? Denialists like Sheff have to blame someone for things like this...we saw the same thing with Farber when Maggiore died. Part of their denial is an inability to see the blood on their own hands.

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  30. Seth,
    I just listened to that horrible Robert Scott Bell Show and you and U of Conn and Dr. Moore need to legally go after Liam Scheff for his comments and accusations and go after Robert Scott Bell for giving Liam the venue for his horrible accusations. Liam actually accused you, and named U of Conn and Dr. Moore and said you would be "Howeling for the death of Karri Stokely today on the internet after hearing the show!!"

    He really is a crazy bastard and he is such an angry, angry person! You could hear it in his voice and in every syllable he utters! He needs to be stopped. Liam Scheff is killing people with his outright lies! Someone really needs to sue him for his horrible, libelous and sladering comments!!
    JTD

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  31. Hey JTD
    I have no idea who Robert Bell is... Seems pretty insignificant. I have not listened to the interview...I doubt I will.

    Because it is insignificant it seems legal action is a waste of time. And because we talking about Liam Shiff, it is obvious that he is not guilty by reason of insanity. More wasted time.

    If it was someone anyone actually listens to or a program anyone ever heard, I would have my lawyer on this. But in this case, crazy is as crazy does.

    ReplyDelete
  32. No doubt you'd be in court in a blink Seth, IF you had any grounds that is.

    Fortunately you can't sue someone for telling the truth. Which goes to prove what they say is indeed the TRUTH.

    Liar is as Liar does.

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  33. AIDS Denialism is a mental health problem. If you ever doubted that, just read the latest from Karri Stokely.

    Anyone who thinks her failing health makes me happy is totally f@#ked in the head. This woman is dying of AIDS while likes of Liam Sheff and David Rasnick stand around cheering her on.

    http://karristokely.blogspot.com/2010/09/submit-submit-submit.html

    ReplyDelete
  34. That is horrible!
    Amazingly horrible.
    If they look carefully up her ass they will find David Rasnick and Celia Farber doing the Happy Deniers Dance.

    ReplyDelete
  35. Wow- Karri is dying of AIDS. Again, this will be another Maggiore. Perhaps a denialist veterinarian will also do an autopsy on her? The denialists have already lined up the excuse in the event of her death - it's the antiretrovirals she took years prior - not AIDS.

    This is sad.

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  36. I know AIDS deniers do not have a monopoly on being despicable creeps, but I'm not sure it was necessary to let through the comment by PinkFloyd to remind us of it in this depressing context.

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  37. I agree with Anonymous above. "PinkFloyd's" comment was repulsive and uncalled for.

    Seth, I realise that allowing HIV/AIDS denialist trolls the space to expose themselves on your blog is important for the purposes of documenting their psychopathology, but a line was crossed there.

    The denialists are frightened and angry, and are currently revving up their insane PR machine - for obvious reasons.

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  38. Wow.Just wow..Its just heartbreaking to read Karri`s blog now.I am almost in shock when i witness how brainwashed some people can be.Its almost like they have joined a religious sect.

    The symptoms she describes indicate soon full-blown AIDS,every single doctor tells her that she is close to death and must to start ARVs at once so they can do the surgery,but STILL she is in denial and continues in the typical denialist-language,using words like : AIDSmafia, non-specific antibody test,very toxic anti-retroviral drugs,"stomach acid", BLACK BOX ARV's etc.

    In this case we can watch the horror of denialism almost online and it really scares me.If you read this Karri,PLEASE PLEASE dont throw your life away and listen to your doctors.

    ReplyDelete
  39. OMG- Clark and Crowe are now telling people to lie to their doctors and authorities and state that they are "taking HIV medicines" when they are not! Even when it puts a child's life at risk!!!

    http://www.omsj.org/blogs/a-question-from-europe

    ReplyDelete
  40. The PinkFloyd comment was out of line. But I read it as a metaphor. A crude metaphor, but a metaphor nonetheless. Can anyone say that Duesberg, Rasnick and their pals are not killing Stockely?

    And the beat goes on. Karri may die from denialism, while Crowe and his retarded followers like Baker keep the insanity alive.

    It never ends.

    ReplyDelete
  41. Yes, I agree that it is parasites like Rasnick and Duesberg and Robert Scott Bell who need to be held to account for their actions in setting up this horrible scenario, this dreadful trap that Ms Stokely now finds herself in.

    But history tells us that they will try to fight this out to the bitter and miserable end, no matter what the cost to the HIV positive victims they exploit.

    And we also know that their first (and probably only) line of defence is attack. We should not be giving them ammunition.

    It's not their lives on the line here.

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  42. Seth, I don't want to sound overly harsh. I understand what PinkFloyd was trying to say, but he said it in a way that is unhelpful - to say the least.

    None of us know whether Karri is going to be able to find a way out of the terrible dilemma she finds herself in. I hope she can. It sounds like she has competent medicos who are doing their best to help. We don't need to make things harder for them, or for her. I'd just ask everyone to bear this in mind.

    Like everyone else here I am disgusted that Scheff, Bell and Rasnick have immediately seized on Karri's terrible situation as an opportunity for their self-serving propaganda. And we all know that they will try to divert attention from their own culpability by trying to start a crazy-fight with their critics. Don't let them.

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  43. I've read that quite a high percentage of HIV negatives show viral loads on HIV-1 PCR tests.

    How is that possible?

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  44. Anonymous..
    "I've read that quite a high percentage of HIV negatives show viral loads on HIV-1 PCR tests."
    Where did you read that? The source matters. Without a source, I can only assume you read it on Henry Baurer's webpage "Why Nessies should not get tested for HIV"

    Snout
    Once again, you are right on target.

    ReplyDelete
  45. Ahem, Seth, which target was Snout aiming at? Like always you start humping the leg of your cronies before checking any facts.

    http://journals.lww.com/aidsonline/Fulltext/1998/15000/False_positives_for_HIV_using_commercial_viral.22.aspx

    Mainstream research is what I'm quoting here. Who is this Henry Bauer?

    ReplyDelete
  46. Ahem, you AIDS Deniers are stuck in the past.

    Just like you quote HIV testing papers from the 1980's, you rely on HIV RNA studies from the 1990's. Quoting ancient history is my favorite thing you guys do. So transparently stupid.

    One thing you are right about... who is Henry Bauer?

    I could not agree more.

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  47. Luke,

    You're a disgrace to the name. Maybe I should get myself a more distinctive username.

    ReplyDelete
  48. Wow. Did the author of this blog attend the same conference at which I spoke? Seems we have a very serious case of "selective hearing" at work here. There was a debate/dialogue. Yes, it was poorly attended yet wonderfully engaging. The two opposing sides of the dialogue actually got along with each other really well, which is an indication of the quality of people who did attend.

    I thought I did a really good job of presenting verifiable data and sources for my points of contention with the HIV establishment. My sister Yaa Simpson, who was on the opposite perspective, attended despite an immense amount of pressure from county employees, supervisors and fellow AIDS pig-trough-feeders, to cancel her presentation. One Nigerian doctor, who had agreed to present, showed up, started a trivial argument before the panel was seated, and stormed out.

    As usual, my Sister Yaa Simpson did a great job of presenting detailed data, charts and trends supporting her position as a paid HIV/AIDS advocate. Problem was, for her, that I refuted much of her presentation because so much of it was outdated or irreverent to the central points of contention. Yaa works in recruiting African Americans for participation in drug trials; a profession occupation with which I am in never-ceasing contention. Blacks as guinea pigs in America is an history that shames us all.

    Lastly, as this very debate indicates, the argument from the dissenters will not go away until the HIV establishment produces the verifiable data to satisfy the basic questions.

    After 21 years of chasing this hypothesis around the world, from UCLA to Johns Hopkins and Emory Univ.; from Accra to London and Buffalo; -- I have seen nothing to convince me to once again believe in the HIV mythology.

    I will continue to look for this evidence.

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  49. I'm glad your little do was "poorly attended yet wonderfully engaging", Keidi.

    Just a tiny hint, brother. Probably not a good idea to refer to your dear sister Yaa Simpson as an "AIDS pig-trough-feeder" while at the same time trying to pretend your event was a respectful exchange of views.

    Kind of makes it obvious what a complete barking psycho you are, in case anyone who hadn't already figured it out.

    Respect, bro.

    ReplyDelete